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[aprssig] The final WIDE2-1,WIDE1-1 solution!

Robert Bruninga bruninga at usna.edu
Sat Apr 2 14:30:51 UTC 2005


>>> greg at clubnet.net 4/1/05 8:28:43 PM >>>
>In LA we instituted one-hop digis... about two months ago 
>with a standard path of WIDE2-2.  These digis allow 
>one-hop digipeating based  on receiving a WIDE1-1, 
>WIDE2-2, WIDE2-1 or WIDE3-3 digipath....[and 2  support
>RELAY]...    A path of RELAY,WIDE2-2 ...may be 
>digipeated 4 times 
>
>If hese same stations use a path of WIDE1-1,WIDE2-1, 
>the same problem will exist ... two hops...

True.  But in LA you simpily continue to promote WIDE2-2 
only even for mobiles and cut off RELAY entirely.   Yes an
occasional visitor may come in and get WIDE1-1,WIDE2-1
double hop, but it should not be a problem.  Also since
it is only 4 digis that are currently enforcing the one-hop
scenario, if worst comes to worse, we simply "fix" those
digis with software if.

Yes LA is unique.  Maybe we can think of other tweaks to
it to help make this fantastic WIDE1-1,WIDE2-1 idea work
(where needed).  Still mobiles should use not use it unless
the area requires fill-in digis...

>But as the configuration becomes more complex, fewer 
>people will understand and will probably default to the 
>way they had it  before.  

Actually I have bdgun re-writing my FIX14439.html web
page and this WIDE1-1,WIDE2-1 solution for fill-in
digis actually *** further simplifies all configurations***.
Now there is nothing left but WIDEn-N in any digi.
There is only one recomeendation for users
All PacComm digis work SEAMLESSLY with the WIDEn-N's
and RELAY, WIDE, TRACE, SS, TRACEn-N are all gone.

I'm still thinking this is the holy grail for APRS.  But still
open to problems we can think of.  SO thanks for the
concerns in LA.  Lets keep thinking....

de WB4APR, Bob


On Apr 1, 2005, at 12:39 PM, Robert Bruninga wrote:

> And now the New n-N Paradigm is complete!
>
> 1) WIDEn-N works everywhere for small values of N
> 2) The RELAY-DUPE and WIDE-DUPE problems are solved
> 3) We can still use fill-in digis
>
> and APRS paths are totally simplified to simply WIDEn-N
> and 2-2 for mobiles and the 1-1,2-1 options for those mobiles
> that think they need it..  Wow , what a day!
>
> Bob
>
>>>> bruninga at usna.edu 4/1/05 3:09:49 PM >>>
> Wes, I think you got it!
>
> 1) We replace RELAY stations with WIDE1-1 stations.
> 2) The general mobile path is WIDE2-2  (or 3-3 if one insists)
> 3)  for those indifviduals that insist they need a fill-in-digi can
> use either of these paths:
>
> WIDE1-1,WIDE2-2      (in areas that can handle 3 hops)
> WIDE1-1,WIDE2-1      (in WIDE2-2 areas)
>
> This completely eliminates the RELAY-DUPE-multiplication
> problem and is fully compatible with the New n-N Paradigm.
> But may not work in LA or areas with WIDE2-2-only digis,
> though I think we can fix that too...
>
> Is this workable?
> Bob
> WB4APR
>
> In those areas that can afford 3 hops AND need
> fill-in-digis, then mobiles in those areas can use
> WIDE1-1,WIDE2-2
>
>>>> Wes Johnston <aprs at kd4rdb.com> 4/1/05 2:47:43 PM >>>
> I think I have it!
>
> A mobile station running W1-1,W2-2 gives 3 hops minimum becuase
> W1-1,W1-1 would cause every home station in town to TX....  But
there
> is
> a real case for running less than 3 hops... If a mobile wants to
limit
> his path to fewer than 3 hops, he can "dummy up" a reduced Wn-n
count
> by
> using W2-1 instead of W2-2.
>
> I still think RELAY stations switching to W1-1 is a good idea.
>
> We could have three recommended paths for mobiles:
> W2-2       ->two hops off digis, if you can hit 1st digi direct
> W1-1,W2-1  ->one hop off house or digi, one more hop off digi
> W1-1,W2-2  ->one hop off house or digi, two more hops off digis
>
> In other words, if you want one hop, we have a solution.... WIDE1-1
> If you want two hops, we have a solution W1-1,W2-1
> If you want three hops, we have a solution W1-1,W2-2
> if you want four hops, we have a solution W1-1,W3-3
>
> And.... W2-2 still works everywhere because all digipeaters will
> respond
> to it.
>
> Wes
>
> Robert Bruninga wrote:
>
>> ARGH! Ur right.  Back to square one.  Too bad the
>> WIDE0-1 idea didnt work... Bummer   Bob
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>>>> "Curt, WE7U" <archer at eskimo.com> 4/1/05 1:15:29 PM >>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>> On Fri, 1 Apr 2005, Robert Bruninga wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>> VIA WIDE2-1,WIDE1-1
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>> Will this work?
>>>
>>>
>>
>> Close, but no cigar.  If someone were using a path of
>> "WIDE2-1,WIDE2-2" and had "house" digi's configured to respond to
>> that first one, you'd end up with:
>>
>>    WIDE2-1,WIDE2-2
>>    WIDE2-1*,WIDE2-2 (house digi relayed it)
>>    WIDE2-1*,WIDE2-1 (hilltop digi relayed it)
>>
>>    WIDE2-1*,WIDE2-1*
>>    WIDE2-1*,WIDE2-1*
>>    WIDE2-1*,WIDE2-1* (all house digi's that could hear the relay)
>>    WIDE2-1*,WIDE2-1*
>>    WIDE2-1*,WIDE2-1*
>>
>> --
>> Curt, WE7U.   APRS Client Comparisons: http://www.eskimo.com/~archer

>> "Lotto:    A tax on people who are bad at math." -- unknown
>> "Windows:  Microsoft's tax on computer illiterates." -- WE7U
>> "The world DOES revolve around me:  I picked the coordinate
system!"
>>
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