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[aprssig] Signal Locator WEB page

Robert Bruninga bruninga at usna.edu
Fri Apr 27 16:00:10 UTC 2007


> >The technique noted above depends on properly equiped mobile
DF
> >units with lots of equipment.
>
> No it does not. The normal Fox hunting equipment consisting 
> of a radio, directional antenna, and of course an antenuator. 

Yes, that was the equipment I was talking about.  The stuff that
is not normally found in most ham mobiles at any instant when we
need it.   I think being able to react to information from any
station in the vicinity at the time, until the fox hounds can be
brought on the scene can greatly improve our ability to localize
signal sources.

> If someone pops up and asks for signal info and bearings 
> because of a jammer or whatever, it is a matter of a few 
> calls to either base stations or other hams to get 
> bearings and go where the crosshairs say the Fox is. 
> An object is placed at the spot by the client software for 
> other "mappers" to visualize, then it is just the normal 
> "close in sniffers" to finish it up..

I worry about the implied solution of a single ICON object when
what is actually the case is a rather large vague area.
Unfocused observers may be lead astray and confused.  I hope
that such objects are the APRS area-objects that draw a larger
circular area of probability.  APRS can display such area
objects and the radius of the circle can be adjusted as the
accuracy of the estimate is improved. 

When the circle of probability object of DF bearings is
displayed at the same time as all of the Omni-DF circles of
probability, they all contribute together to the overall
solution.  Too many times I have seen instantaneous DF bearing
intersections to be DEAD wrong.  And putting out wrong
infomratino permanently contined into a single point on a map
which has no indication to the viewer as to the degree of
probability, can be very missleading..  Just something to watch
out for.

> >Uiview doesn't even provide the fundamental antenna 
> >height and coverage info without people loading an add-on.  
> >And without being able to see instantly what approximate 
> >area coverage each home station has, then it is hopeless 
> >to make any sense out of Uiview stations.
> 
> Sorry to hear you consistantly "bash" another client 
> the way you have over the years! A shame on you Bob.

Im sorry to hear you see it as bashing.  It is simply
fundamental to ham radio that the single most important
parameter to any station (besides his location) is his antenna
height.  Antenna height can have a difference in station
coverage from an HT with maybe 4 square miles to a house on a
hill which can cover 40,000 square miles.  It is a big loss to
ham radio to have a client that has omitted this fundamental
element of APRS that makes its users blind to the difference in
coverage between these two stations.

And also since the client doesn't transmit this fundamental
parameter, it makes all of the rest of APRS also blind to the
range of all these stations.  Without being able to discriminate
between the station coverage of an HT and a guy on a 3000'
mountain, the RF domain of APRS (ham radio) is being leveled to
a flat playing field of not much more than internet DOTS on a
map, completely ignoring the importance of the local RF
propogation domain.

The idea of APRS was to have a common tool set so that everone
was seeing the same basic information presented in a consistent
manner.  Not having subsets of people with widely different
capabilitys and significantly different views.

It would be nice if Uiview could be distributed as bundled
package with all the needed add-ons, so that all users were
playing from the same deck.
Unless all APRS users are seeing the same fundamental info with
the same potential tools, we cannot work as a team and cannot do
all the things that we could be doing.

> I find it hard to conceive interest in a web page of some 
> df'ing in another part of the country which would probably 
> be woefully out of date, even if I could participate, :-)

Agree.  But it is not intended for that purpose.  It is intended
for -local- use anywhere at any time by anyone in their -own-
area as a single tool that everyone in his area can use in real
time.  They can get the data into the system and plotted so that
they can solve the local problem in real time and so that
everyone with data has a place to enter it.

This allows every local ham to instantly participate, enter data
and view the results, EITHER with his APRS station, his Mobile
or his WEB Browser.  This lets everyone in the area participate,
not just the APRS folks.  This would really wake up some clubs
to the potential for APRS on *RF*...

> Sorry Bob, the more you complain about UI-View, 
> the more I like it... :-)

I'm sorry you see it that way.  The limitations of some clients
and WEB displays that cannot display this fundamental
information skews APRS into just a vehicle tracking system and
that is preventing us from doing a lot of what we could
accomplish with a real-time-tactical information exchange
signaling channel. 

The RF domain is not just DOTS on a MAP!  It is areas, ranges,
and propogation and capabilities (all driven by HEIGHT!)  I wish
this were not viewed as an emotional issue, but just a practical
look at what needs to be done for APRS to live up to its
potential.

Bob WB4APR






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