From bob at sinister.com  Thu Oct  4 08:47:00 2007
From: bob at sinister.com (Bob Keyes)
Date: Thu, 4 Oct 2007 04:47:00 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Ham-80211] 23cm transverters for 802.11>
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.58L0.0710040442200.15965@dark.sinister.com>

It shure would be interesting if we could get something like one of the
Ubiquiti cards for the 23cm band. Do you think it's worth asking Ubiquiti
to make a model for the ham industry, or is this something we should just
do ourselves?

What's involved in making a transverter anyhow? I think I get the basic
ide (oscillator, mixer, filter), but any more specific info would be
useful. Especially at microwave freuencies.
73,
Bob
N1YRK



From tarvid at ls.net  Thu Oct  4 11:55:21 2007
From: tarvid at ls.net (Jim Tarvid)
Date: Thu, 4 Oct 2007 07:55:21 -0400
Subject: [Ham-80211] 23cm transverters for 802.11>
In-Reply-To: <Pine.LNX.4.58L0.0710040442200.15965@dark.sinister.com>
References: <Pine.LNX.4.58L0.0710040442200.15965@dark.sinister.com>
Message-ID: <41acbd2a0710040455l902804atd903bcf4a30ef104@mail.gmail.com>

SR9 and XR9 should work in the 33cm band. The TX channels of the XR9
are not entirely compatible with the "official" band plan but are
inband. Perhaps someone with experience can advise about that aspect.
In many areas including mine, band use is low to non-existent except
for old wireless home phones.

Jim



On 10/4/07, Bob Keyes <bob at sinister.com> wrote:
> It shure would be interesting if we could get something like one of the
> Ubiquiti cards for the 23cm band. Do you think it's worth asking Ubiquiti
> to make a model for the ham industry, or is this something we should just
> do ourselves?
>
> What's involved in making a transverter anyhow? I think I get the basic
> ide (oscillator, mixer, filter), but any more specific info would be
> useful. Especially at microwave freuencies.
> 73,
> Bob
> N1YRK
>
> _______________________________________________
> ham-80211 mailing list
> ham-80211 at lists.tapr.org
> https://lists.tapr.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/ham-80211
>



From kb9mwr at yahoo.com  Sat Oct  6 06:43:41 2007
From: kb9mwr at yahoo.com (Steve)
Date: Sat, 6 Oct 2007 01:43:41 -0500
Subject: [Ham-80211] Re:  23cm transverters for 802.11>
Message-ID: <001301c807e4$3d3376e0$b301a8c0@hp>

I think that would also be interesting.  I don't think it can hurt to ask. 
However I've emailed Ubiquiti in the past with no response.  (But don't let 
that discourage you, maybe someone else knows a better email contact address 
to use.)

It would seem to me that they might have a potential customer base just out 
side the 1.2 GHz ham space, as the PCS broadband stuff is above our 
allocations.  I'm sure there is a ton of other re-purposed frequency 
allocations in the 1-2 GHz area.

Channels 3-6 are useable in the 900 ham/ISM band, with 4&5 at full boar.

I wonder how far the SR9 can swing in frequency.  I know the XR3 is fully 
compatible with the publicly available Atheros Linux MADWIFI driver.  I'm 
not sure if the SR9 is.  But if there is a way to enable the SR9 to address 
additional channels.  For example: Channel 1 would have a low freq of 922 
MHz and a high of 942 MHz..  Channel 11 would have a low of 872 and high of 
892 MHz.  If you can address unconventional channels using a MikroTik driver 
or the alike you might be able to get pretty close to 1 GHz, assuming the 
board is capable.






From kb9mwr at yahoo.com  Sat Oct  6 06:52:55 2007
From: kb9mwr at yahoo.com (Steve)
Date: Sat, 6 Oct 2007 01:52:55 -0500
Subject: [Ham-80211] Rw: 23cm transverters for 802.11>
Message-ID: <000b01c807e5$86ed1a10$b301a8c0@hp>

As for making a transverter, take a look at this:

http://www.qsl.net/n9zia/trans/index.html

What we've found is the tricky part is the switching times.  Which is why a 
lot of our work revolved around FHSS equipment.  It's just easier to work 
with.

Teletronics does list a 2.4 GHz to 1.2 GHz transverter on their site.  But 
I'm sure the price is ridicilous.







From bob at sinister.com  Sun Oct  7 08:49:43 2007
From: bob at sinister.com (Bob Keyes)
Date: Sun, 7 Oct 2007 04:49:43 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Ham-80211] Rw: 23cm transverters for 802.11>
In-Reply-To: <000b01c807e5$86ed1a10$b301a8c0@hp>
References: <000b01c807e5$86ed1a10$b301a8c0@hp>
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.58L0.0710070442090.9470@dark.sinister.com>



On Sat, 6 Oct 2007, Steve wrote:

> As for making a transverter, take a look at this:
>
> http://www.qsl.net/n9zia/trans/index.html
>
> What we've found is the tricky part is the switching times.  Which is why a
> lot of our work revolved around FHSS equipment.  It's just easier to work
> with.

mmm yes but HFSS 802.11 equipment's pretty much fallen by the wayside.

> Teletronics does list a 2.4 GHz to 1.2 GHz transverter on their site.  But
> I'm sure the price is ridicilous.

I am sure it is.

seeing the GBPPR site reminds me of a sister site from a while back,
guerrilla.net. I know that Mr. Brian Oblivion from that site moved to
Pennsylvania and was doing work on making transverters for 802.11 for
military applications. But I've lost contact with him.

I wonder if some of our switching issues could be mitigated by selecting a
long preamble. Just an off-the-cuff, half-assed thought.

Or, maybe two radios for full duplex operation, getting rid of switching
altogether.

I have some SR9s at work. I am going to pop the can lid off of it and see
what they've got inside for transverter components.



From bob at sinister.com  Sun Oct  7 09:19:18 2007
From: bob at sinister.com (Bob Keyes)
Date: Sun, 7 Oct 2007 05:19:18 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Ham-80211] Rw: 23cm transverters for 802.11>
In-Reply-To: <000b01c807e5$86ed1a10$b301a8c0@hp>
References: <000b01c807e5$86ed1a10$b301a8c0@hp>
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.58L0.0710070505210.11251@dark.sinister.com>



On Sat, 6 Oct 2007, Steve wrote:

> What we've found is the tricky part is the switching times.  Which is why a
> lot of our work revolved around FHSS equipment.  It's just easier to work
> with.

I just had another idea on switching times: If we were able to get the
firmware to signal that it was going to start transmitting, and then delay
enough ns for the switch to kick in, that should solve the problem. Of
course, you have to be able to get down into the low-level functions of
the WiFi chipset in order to do that. In the past, this might not have
been so easy but the drivers for the Atheros chipset have been
reverse-engineered and a fully open-source driver been built, called
OpenHAL. This is already the default driver for OpenBSD and will shortly
be the Atheros driver for Linux. I know that the Atheros chipset relies
heavily on the host systems CPU, instead of having its own on-board
microcontroller like earlier radio cards, so I am pretty sure this is
possible. However, it still may take some doing to uncover exactly what
would need to be reprogrammed in order to accomplish this.

Another thing about the Atheros cards was one of the primary (purported)
impetus for having the driver closed-source in the first place was to
prevent people from going out of authorized bands. However, this dam has
already been burst, so to speak, as there is a value that can be placed
into the 'country code' register that will allow universal coverage, into
areas well outside the Part 15 bands. So far, there have been no reports
of the feared hoards of 'free channel' modern-day version of the CB
hackers of old causing widespread chaos. In any case, this should allow
hams to take full advantage of WiFi gear for 2.4 ghz operation, and also
allow us more flexibility when using transverters.




From Mike_Staines at Email.com  Sun Oct  7 12:10:40 2007
From: Mike_Staines at Email.com (Mike Staines)
Date: Sun, 7 Oct 2007 08:10:40 -0400
Subject: [Ham-80211] Signal Sources
Message-ID: <002301c808db$14deb9a0$6800ff2c@hp633>

All the talk about transverters popped a question in my mind from long ago:

Is it possible to use 802.11 cards/APs/whatever as CW transmitters?

Can the drivers be modified to pick one frequency instead of hopping around and toggle carrier on and off?

Mike
WM1KE
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From gerry.creager at tamu.edu  Sun Oct  7 13:03:31 2007
From: gerry.creager at tamu.edu (Gerry Creager)
Date: Sun, 07 Oct 2007 08:03:31 -0500
Subject: [Ham-80211] Signal Sources
In-Reply-To: <002301c808db$14deb9a0$6800ff2c@hp633>
References: <002301c808db$14deb9a0$6800ff2c@hp633>
Message-ID: <4708D923.4030300@tamu.edu>

802.11 uses a constellation of carriers centered about a center 
frequency which defines the "channel"  I'm not sure if I'd want to try 
to on-off key these things like CW.  And to be honest, I do not know if 
any of the open source software has twiddled the bits to do this.

gerry

Mike Staines wrote:
> All the talk about transverters popped a question in my mind from long ago:
>  
> Is it possible to use 802.11 cards/APs/whatever as CW transmitters?
>  
> Can the drivers be modified to pick one frequency instead of hopping 
> around and toggle carrier on and off?
>  
> Mike
> WM1KE
> 
> 
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> _______________________________________________
> ham-80211 mailing list
> ham-80211 at lists.tapr.org
> https://lists.tapr.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/ham-80211

-- 
Gerry Creager -- gerry.creager at tamu.edu
Texas Mesonet -- AATLT, Texas A&M University	
Cell: 979.229.5301 Office: 979.458.4020 FAX: 979.862.3983
Office: 1700 Research Parkway Ste 160, TAMU, College Station, TX 77843



From Mike_Staines at Email.com  Sun Oct  7 16:18:27 2007
From: Mike_Staines at Email.com (Mike Staines)
Date: Sun, 7 Oct 2007 12:18:27 -0400
Subject: [Ham-80211] Signal Sources
References: <002301c808db$14deb9a0$6800ff2c@hp633> <4708D923.4030300@tamu.edu>
Message-ID: <003c01c808fd$b203ca00$6800ff2c@hp633>

Thanks, Gerry...

I have a plethora of 802.11 gear here and it just seemed a shame that I 
could not use one of the units for a little non-802.11 work.
Just FMing the carrier between two discrete, nearby, frequencies at a very 
low data rate would allow for some DFCW fun at some nifty distances with 
existing ham software.

Dreaming,
Mike
wM1KE
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Gerry Creager" <gerry.creager at tamu.edu>
To: "TAPR Mailing List for Ham Radio Use of 802.11" 
<ham-80211 at lists.tapr.org>
Sent: Sunday, October 07, 2007 9:03 AM
Subject: Re: [Ham-80211] Signal Sources


> 802.11 uses a constellation of carriers centered about a center frequency 
> which defines the "channel"  I'm not sure if I'd want to try to on-off key 
> these things like CW.  And to be honest, I do not know if any of the open 
> source software has twiddled the bits to do this.
>
> gerry
>
> Mike Staines wrote:
>> All the talk about transverters popped a question in my mind from long 
>> ago:
>>  Is it possible to use 802.11 cards/APs/whatever as CW transmitters?
>>  Can the drivers be modified to pick one frequency instead of hopping 
>> around and toggle carrier on and off?
>>  Mike
>> WM1KE
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> ham-80211 mailing list
>> ham-80211 at lists.tapr.org
>> https://lists.tapr.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/ham-80211
>
> -- 
> Gerry Creager -- gerry.creager at tamu.edu
> Texas Mesonet -- AATLT, Texas A&M University Cell: 979.229.5301 Office: 
> 979.458.4020 FAX: 979.862.3983
> Office: 1700 Research Parkway Ste 160, TAMU, College Station, TX 77843
>
> _______________________________________________
> ham-80211 mailing list
> ham-80211 at lists.tapr.org
> https://lists.tapr.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/ham-80211 




From jeff at aerodata.net  Tue Oct  9 13:35:55 2007
From: jeff at aerodata.net (jeff at aerodata.net)
Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 08:35:55 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [Ham-80211] Signal Sources
In-Reply-To: <003c01c808fd$b203ca00$6800ff2c@hp633>
References: <002301c808db$14deb9a0$6800ff2c@hp633>
	<4708D923.4030300@tamu.edu> <003c01c808fd$b203ca00$6800ff2c@hp633>
Message-ID: <1735.67.39.248.214.1191936955.squirrel@www.aerodata.net>

I have some intersil test software (and docs) that can do that. If you
have a PRISM chip set, ping me back and I'll get it to you. Your on your
own figuring it out however.

IOSOFT wrote some drivers for the PRISM chip set for the pic (not kidding,
I licensed it and it (kinda) worked).


> Thanks, Gerry...
>
> I have a plethora of 802.11 gear here and it just seemed a shame that I
> could not use one of the units for a little non-802.11 work.
> Just FMing the carrier between two discrete, nearby, frequencies at a very
> low data rate would allow for some DFCW fun at some nifty distances with
> existing ham software.
>
> Dreaming,
> Mike
> wM1KE
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Gerry Creager" <gerry.creager at tamu.edu>
> To: "TAPR Mailing List for Ham Radio Use of 802.11"
> <ham-80211 at lists.tapr.org>
> Sent: Sunday, October 07, 2007 9:03 AM
> Subject: Re: [Ham-80211] Signal Sources
>
>
>> 802.11 uses a constellation of carriers centered about a center
>> frequency
>> which defines the "channel"  I'm not sure if I'd want to try to on-off
>> key
>> these things like CW.  And to be honest, I do not know if any of the
>> open
>> source software has twiddled the bits to do this.
>>
>> gerry
>>
>> Mike Staines wrote:
>>> All the talk about transverters popped a question in my mind from long
>>> ago:
>>>  Is it possible to use 802.11 cards/APs/whatever as CW transmitters?
>>>  Can the drivers be modified to pick one frequency instead of hopping
>>> around and toggle carrier on and off?
>>>  Mike
>>> WM1KE
>>>
>>>
>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> ham-80211 mailing list
>>> ham-80211 at lists.tapr.org
>>> https://lists.tapr.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/ham-80211
>>
>> --
>> Gerry Creager -- gerry.creager at tamu.edu
>> Texas Mesonet -- AATLT, Texas A&M University Cell: 979.229.5301 Office:
>> 979.458.4020 FAX: 979.862.3983
>> Office: 1700 Research Parkway Ste 160, TAMU, College Station, TX 77843
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> ham-80211 mailing list
>> ham-80211 at lists.tapr.org
>> https://lists.tapr.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/ham-80211
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> ham-80211 mailing list
> ham-80211 at lists.tapr.org
> https://lists.tapr.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/ham-80211
>





From kb9mwr at yahoo.com  Thu Oct 11 05:31:46 2007
From: kb9mwr at yahoo.com (Steve)
Date: Thu, 11 Oct 2007 00:31:46 -0500
Subject: [Ham-80211] Ubiquiti
Message-ID: <000501c80bc8$05347db0$b301a8c0@hp>

700 MHz, XR7.

http://www.dailywireless.org/2007/10/09/7054/