[nos-bbs] 44-net

[(Skip) K8RRA]

A lot of what you say speaks to me Brian...

<rant-alt>
On Tue, 2008-01-22 at 23:08 -0500, Brian wrote:
> <rant>
> 
> On Tue, 2008-01-22 at 18:50 -0800, ac7yy wrote:
>    
> > I am curious as to why you say that a 44.x.x address should be used?
> 
> > Kim - AC7YY
> 
> A better question really would be:
> "how would 44-net be best used?"
How about the question:
"What benefit is there to me in 44... today and perhaps tomorrow?" 

> >>SNIP<< Over the course of time, there's been many many hams
> who've dedicated an extreme amount of hours writing source-code and
> coming up with applications for the amateur community to use and enjoy,
> primarily with the intent that 44-net space would be used.
SO -- First there was packet amateur radio based on AX.25 with some
benefits like mail forwarding and networking with protocols like
net/rom.  Then came TCP/IP encapsulated within AX with benefits like
world-wide networking of AMPR 44... including another email delivery
[smtp] plus other protocols of Internet as side benefits.  Today
additional Internet resources includes VOIP with Echolink, IRLP, Wires;
yet another new "fork" in digital D-star breaks with this trend.  TCP/IP
directly over the air on amateur radio has not supplanted the original
encap so mixed networks can and do co-exist and extend the usefulness of
installed hardware thanks to those many un-named hams.  It is perhaps
not a shining example of government self-interest when advances of one
area of the world may not find utilization in all others?

In any case, what 44... brings is a narrow world-wide presence for a
(digital) ham today.  As you point out that presence is in fact not what
we can call pervasive and it brings with it problems today and a real
potential for not being available tomorrow...

> >>SNIP<< and there's nothing you can do but switch
> providers until you find one that will let you do what you wish to do.
In step with the ISP are the hardware suppliers who defeat IP
encapsulation by firmware design -- probably to the benefit of ISPs who
permit their use on their networks.  

There may be opportunity in what you place on the table.  Consider the
reason for our difficulty is brought on by those who abuse the ISP with
spam and virus, the very things that make our lives as Internet users
miserable.  Perhaps we hams should partner with our local ISP to
discover and fight abuse on Internet like some of us fight abuse of RF
spectrum?

A small example of that is here at home where I have given thought to
installing a honey pot and reporting to my ISP and other anti-span/virus
organizations.  On another level, I am now trying to get my head around
iptables for the benefit of stopping what I now interpret to be
bot-attacks looking for opportunity to break into my computer while
keeping AMPR traffic wide open.  These attacks are actually finding a
way on to RF by way of my friends AMPR node -- thus need to be filtered
out.

I certainly agree with your perception, and while I personally may be
headed down a profitless road, perhaps there is a better way we as a
group can act to preserve the benefit we now have and build on it rather
than let it pass?

Not long ago I started down the AMPR database only to find less than 1/2
of the listed nodes responded.  My choice of nodes played into the
results, so don't interpret 50% as total reality.  I suspect a number of
things conspire to reduce the database to less than 100% available.  One
big component may be a shift in personal interests and application of
energy into another aspect of life.  It leads me to wonder how large our
community really is without losing sleep over the lack of answer.

One thing we probably do owe aspiring users of AMPR is an easier way to
get on board with our "job" being to provide fuller understanding of
44... plus painless registration of new IP assignments.  Another thing
we may owe ourselves is an automated way to exclude [lock out] the
abuses we fear and those that have already shrunk our membership.

> >>SNIP<< As botnets, worms,
> viri, etc continues to grow don't be surprised to see more and more
> ports and protocols being filtered by ISPs in an attempt to keep their
> own networks clean.
Another technology that ISPs will need to preserve for their own revenue
is VPN.  Our IP tunnel is not far from the intent of VPN, but we are not
employing IPsec and other security measures.  The class of equipment
most of us use may not be suitable to VPN, but if we are to preserve
44... perhaps our future will require that AMPR upgrade to gain access
to Internet.  Probably at higher cost -- certainly at higher tech
experience -- groan...

On the other hand -- think how focused spammers and the virus originator
community is.  I'm not convinced that only buying McAfee-like software
and giving government the responsibility of dealing with such
anti-social behavior is particularly effective.

> >>SNIP<< The best way to compliment these
> guys who put in more than their share of time and efforts is if you use
> their products, use them on ampr.org.
I pose to you that these guys have led us into making our world a
smaller place.  While we hams can find and maintain friendships over HF
SSB, Internet doesn't suffer propagation challenges that the RF radio
does.  Setting up a packet presence in our neighborhood based on AX.25
is a good first step and is well supported by hardware and training.
Packet radio nicely serves what we can hear locally.  The second logical
step is to extend the network beyond the distance of AX and TCP makes
global reach via Internet pretty straight forward, albeit a bit more
complex.

The basics are in place, now we need a ham application like facebook to
glue our interests.  Internet, while it is a groovy tool that augments
ham radio, can still be thought of as just another rig with it's own set
of characteristics used to satisfy our experimental nature and our need
to interact?

> 
> Technically speaking do you *need* to? By all means _no_, however it
> seems the less we use something we've had given to us, the more we tend
> to lose it such the case with 11-meters, and also such with part of the
> 220 band allocations. If someone has trouble with setting it up, the
> amprgate list is a great resource to use (and is a quiet list at that).
QSL

> 
> </rant> </rant-alt>

73
de [George (Skip) VerDuin] K8RRA k